Please - do not mock The Fantastic Forum

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rumike
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Post by rumike » 05-12-2011 03:54 AM

Sean,

Who were the last three mods that Linnea entrusted to steer the ship?

Shirleypal
Swerdloc
SETIsLady

These people were close friends who were in frequent if not constant communication with Linnea.

Fan, whom I'm sure is very nice, said right up front that he did not know what Linnea wanted.

For my part, once you earned Linnea's trust she was a loyal friend. I took a little break from this board due to some major personal issues. When I came back, I was immediately attacked and called names by a newbie. Linnea defended my name immediately. She was like that. That was only a scant few days before her passing, and the last interaction I had with her.

Recently, when another troll, who had dragged Linnea's name through the dirt and smeared her all over the net a few years back tried to buy this ship, I called him out using the truth of his past and using knowledge of the situation that I had access to that was not public. He said "Rumike has no idea what he's talking about." And the troll who tried to DESTROY this ship got away with that.

She defended mine, and I will defend Linnea's name for the rest of my life.

Nighters.
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Sean_in_Montreal
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Post by Sean_in_Montreal » 05-12-2011 04:19 AM

rumike wrote: Sean,

Who were the last three mods that Linnea entrusted to steer the ship?

Shirleypal
Swerdloc
SETIsLady

These people were close friends who were in frequent if not constant communication with Linnea.

Fan, whom I'm sure is very nice, said right up front that he did not know what Linnea wanted.

For my part, once you earned Linnea's trust she was a loyal friend. I took a little break from this board due to some major personal issues. When I came back, I was immediately attacked and called names by a newbie. Linnea defended my name immediately. She was like that. That was only a scant few days before her passing, and the last interaction I had with her.

Recently, when another troll, who had dragged Linnea's name through the dirt and smeared her all over the net a few years back tried to buy this ship, I called him out using the truth of his past and using knowledge of the situation that I had access to that was not public. He said "Rumike has no idea what he's talking about." And the troll who tried to DESTROY this ship got away with that.

She defended mine, and I will defend Linnea's name for the rest of my life.

Nighters.


As you should. :)

Another upside down flag. :rolleyes:

You guys don't know how lucky you are he didn't wind up owning this place and Fan did.
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Post by Joolz » 05-12-2011 05:58 AM

The only one “mocking” here is you, Sean. The upside-down flag as a symbol has been explained. It is not meant as disrespect to her in any way. Linnea was my FRIEND. I loved her dearly, and still do. I would not and am not mocking anything that she did here. Not EVER. So, please just stop. Lay off on the jibes about it. We should be free to express our distress and our grief however we choose, especially under the circumstances.

I’m glad you say that you “understand” why we did what we did, although I am not sure you really do. You say “You guys don't know how lucky you are he didn't wind up owning this place.” We obviously know more than you think we do. We know a LOT more than you give us credit for in your mind. Where were you when that transaction was going down? Why didn’t you speak up? If it weren’t for SETIsLady stepping up to the plate and speaking her mind, it WOULD have happened. She had our backs. Did you? Did Fan?

What has happened here is done. Nothing can change it. It is what it is. As rumike said, I am sure that Fan is a nice guy. It’s a bit sad that someone had to actually ask “Who are you?,” though. I actually feel a bit sorry for him that he stepped into this mess, but it was his choice. He might have talked to people about it beforehand, though, as Linnea would have done. You know… asked people how they felt about it? Respected the community enough to have asked for advice and opinions beforehand? But he didn’t, so he owns what he did and didn’t do in that respect.

The reality here is that I don’t know him and I don’t know you. Maybe some here know you from other places on the internet, but many of us did not frequent those other places because we were loyal to THIS place, and to Linnea. Neither of you posted enough here for the community that was here to know much about you. Neither of you were here to participate in those long, soul-searching threads begun by Linnea wanting to know what WE, the community, wanted for OUR Ship. She always said it belonged not to HER, but to ALL of US. That’s how she wanted it. We weathered storms together while you merely sat on the sidelines. But now, you and your friend, Fan, propose to lead us. This may work just fine for some, but for others, it simply won’t. Don’t expect everyone to be happy about what has happened. Allow us our grief. For many of us who loved Linnea as a personal friend, this just isn’t going work. Sorry, but that is the truth of the matter.

The only Captain here ever, in my mind, will be Linnea. This Ship was never about the technical aspects, the forum software—it was about the PEOPLE and about the woman who bravely tried to create something unique, a community with a living, beating heart. She put her heart and soul into this place. She is gone, and the heart and soul has left with her. It can’t be rebuilt because it isn’t something tangible. If you don’t understand that, then you really have no idea who Linnea was nor how to carry on her legacy. Therein lies the problem.

You’ve taken the Ship. Do what you will with it. Create something new, something else. But you can’t carry on Linnea’s legacy because you don’t even understand what it was. You were never really an active part of it. You didn’t KNOW her. I wish you luck, as you should those of us who are setting sail to new ports.

I don’t want to post here again because it simply hurts too much to do so. I only did this time, to speak my piece in regard to this issue. There are many of us who feel this way, so please just let it be. It’s done.
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SquidInk
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Post by SquidInk » 05-12-2011 09:31 AM

Here's the bottom line:

The archives (you know, the words of our shipmates, like Linnea, JQ, Devistated, Gorm, and many other great pirates who came and went before I arrived) have been preserved. Folks like me (and you) can enter those archives and live, re-live, learn, and re-learn from those amazing people - because their body of work has been graciously preserved by a person who saw the value in doing so.

Beyond that, the details hardly matter - do they? - things worked out well.

Like the rest of us, Fan is a truthseeker, an ART Bell... fan... and a friend to the community. Why don't we embrace this effort, and even try to be of assistance? Is there anybody who doesn't want to see the archive preserved? If so, speak up.

All of us - from all of the C2C boards, including those who chose to 'sail on', aboard the FF2, without the archive (thinking it was lost, I presume) - will now continue to have the opportunity, at their leisure, to peruse that wondrous hall of records for years to come.

I think that's deserving of some praise (along with any constructive criticisms), don't you? I have to believe that Linnea, who spent a small fortune in order to build & store those archives, must be pleased at their continuing preservation - even if, like the rest of us, she is left scratching her head at the odd way in which it came about. I for one will be spending many hours in those archives, as I have always done - and you know, I bet I'll see you there one day too..

Best of luck to FF2 , II, IW, and the mighty FF!
Last edited by SquidInk on 05-12-2011 09:56 AM, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Fan » 05-12-2011 10:12 AM

I would ask that people please do not presume to know my history or feelings with and about Linnea, and I will not of you. We all have different history. Even if you don't mean it that way it can be quite insulting.

Let's keep tempers down, let's let the ship sail for a while, and perhaps I can prove my intentions through actions rather than words. All are welcome, and I do hope I can gain your trust and even friendship at some point. I won't close the thread, but please let us respect each other and be civil.

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Kaztronic
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Post by Kaztronic » 05-12-2011 10:46 AM

Sean_in_Montreal wrote:
Kaz, and me, see


Sean, you really ought to be certain that we are on the same page before you say something along the lines of "Kaz and me".

In this case, you've read my initial post on this matter and added a little something to my thoughts, suggesting that I think the avatars and tags in question here are intended to disrespect Linnea.

While I will likely continue to disagree with them about their use of those avatars, and more strongly disagree with the coordinated taglines that do not fit in with the rest of the explanation - I know for a fact, because I know these people, that disrespect of Linnea was never in their minds, would never be something they would seek to do - ever. So Sean, please don't presume to speak for what I see. I wrote down what I saw, my words were carefully chosen, and intentionally limited - because I know that the intent had nothing to do with Linnea.

As for the avatars and taglines themselves, and the explanation provided, it is true that a ship that is in distress flies an upside-down flag. Personally, I think it would have been more fitting to put up avatars that show a pirate flag at half-mast (such images exist on Bing), but that is just my opinion, and hindsight is always 20/20. As for the coordinated taglines, "anchors aweigh" has nothing to do with a ship in distress - it means quite the opposite, bringing me full circle, back to my original post in this thread.

Personally, my hope is to see the archives of this ship preserved as much as possible as they were, with minimal changes (it's a mission for me right now actually - it feels like the right thing to do). As we all know, when a person changes their avatar, and tagline, it changes on every post they have ever written prior. Those coordinated tags and avatars now grace tens of thousands of posts, reaching in to every deck, reaching right in to the history of this forum. I think it unfortunate that the past history of this ship should be saturated with a message about something happening in the present. I hope it is temporary for that reason.
Last edited by Kaztronic on 05-12-2011 10:55 AM, edited 1 time in total.
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Raggedyann
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Post by Raggedyann » 05-12-2011 11:24 AM

Bobbi Snow wrote: I'm staying... that is, if any of you want me to be here. I used to post more than I do now, but life has become quite complicated for me, and I don't have the time I used to, to surf the threads.

I will continue to post here and I am glad you are going to as well Bobby.

Being in the same environment everyday is a constant reminder of the one who's been lost forever. I was only privileged to know Linnea through posts, yet I feel the emptiness here. So I can imagine what her many close friends and long term shipmates must have been feeling over the past days. SETIslady and others have provided a bit of respite from grief and pain and I can understand and respect that.

There is an awful echo around the ship but hopefully that will change over time if Fan has the patience to wait. If the mates never find the will to return perhaps the ship will attract new mates and keep sailing.
Last edited by Raggedyann on 05-12-2011 11:28 AM, edited 1 time in total.

CoastZone
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Post by CoastZone » 05-12-2011 12:06 PM

Originally posted by Sean_in_Montreal


You guys don't know how lucky you are he didn't wind up owning this place and Fan did.


Hey sean. Could we talk sometime? I've made my peace with others and want to talk with you. I was a kid who made plenty of mistakes but didn't see it or just didn't care. Then I grew up and it sank through.

Others have given me that second chance. I am asking you for your forgiveness for the past. I just want to move on. And you, whether or not you realize it, your words have haunted me for a long time. Your words made me do a retake of my life.

So, in part I owe it to you that I changed. Got married and became a better person. God is also part of that. Along with Scott.

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Post by CoastZone » 05-12-2011 12:13 PM

rumike wrote: Sean,


Recently, when another troll, who had dragged Linnea's name through the dirt and smeared her all over the net a few years back tried to buy this ship, I called him out using the truth of his past and using knowledge of the situation that I had access to that was not public. He said "Rumike has no idea what he's talking about." And the troll who tried to DESTROY this ship got away with that.

She defended mine, and I will defend Linnea's name for the rest of my life.

Nighters.


I am no troll. Trust me, if I were. Fan would remove me. Fan and I had almost never seen eye to eye until recently. I changed inside. That is what happened.

I again never once said anything terrible about Linnea. I may have said some negative things in 2004, but who the heck didn't say bad things either about the side who got planked or those who planked us.

It was an equal playing field of negativity. The buck doesn't start nor stop with me. All sides were guilty. Some of my side took it to the extreme. I got the blame.

I wasn't attacking you. Just stating what in my opinion was true. Were you around in 2004 when all this went down? I don't know, just asking for clarification.

This is a new FF and I hope the negativity of the past can be washed away and cleansed on a manner that Linnea would have approved.

She welcomed me here in 2009. I asked her upon registering if I would be welcomed. Her one issue was that nobody know who I was. I agreed.

Now I see why. Fan is a great person. Much better than I was in the old days. A much better server tech than I may ever be as well.

You are all in good hands.
Last edited by CoastZone on 05-12-2011 12:23 PM, edited 1 time in total.

CoastZone
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Post by CoastZone » 05-12-2011 12:23 PM

I also want to say that this is the Fantastic Forum. No other can claim its rich history in the world of Coast to Coast AM.

It is my sincere hope that Art Bell isn't about the ownership of the forum. Instead is about how the people here has supported him through out the years.

A few members may leave. They alone do not make up the forum. Even if they were strong supporters of the forum. If they leave now, they show no loyalty.

Fan deserves great respect for not only saving the FF from oblivion (which would have happened), but also in that he is a great person inside and out.

Give him the chance to prove himself as a leader for this forum before leaving and starting anew.

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Live365
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Post by Live365 » 05-12-2011 12:27 PM

Man. I am so out of the loop of what is going on here my head is spinning. What I can say, is that my initial thought before even reading the posts was: “I think Kaz misunderstood. They’re flying the flag at half mast.” Now I see Kaz twigged to that as well. It’s already been said by Pirates far greater than I. If you don’t know these people well enough to know that they would as soon cut out their tongues than disrespect Linnea, then you don’t know them. And there in lies half the problem.

The sequence of events, as I saw them, were this: we lost our Angel of eleven years. Once we started to regain consciousness, Revisedcode sent out an SOS saying he couldn’t keep the Ship afloat alone. I know the donations came pouring in, but he was relying on snail-mail. The check I sent still hasn’t been cashed. To this day, he probably doesn’t know how much money he had to work with, and there’s a certain tragic irony in that. But it’s done, and God knows he needs his own time to heal. I came to the Ship several times during that period to find it completely down, and I figured, well, that’s it then. But what I didn’t know while I was scrambling to find E-mail addresses and Facebook profiles, is that long-time, long-loyal and long-revered Pirates were coming together from every corner of the country to put the Ship back together in a different place. While this was going on, some guy – who’d posted just days before his concern that someone would take the Forum in a different direction – stepped forward to introduce himself as the new owner…but for the fact that he somehow couldn’t get the fee to RC. Our Lady, the Gentle Lioness, came forward to put an immediate end to that. Then Svladjelli – who I remember well – came in as Fan, and got the Ship back up. By then, however, there was a new, fresh, happy place which throbbed with invigorated life, and I knew immediately in my heart my future was there. Those were the sequence of events, as I saw them.

I’m so blissfully ignorant about all this that I don’t bear animosity toward any camp. I agree and disagree with nearly everything that has been written here. But let me say I think Fan is a decent man with good intentions. But let me also say that this incarnation of the Fantastic Forum, in my belief, will either not survive, or will turn into a completely different place. And you know what? Maybe it should. Fan, yer a brave soul, and God Bless you for what you’ve done here. I wish you nothing but the best as you head out into the future.
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Post by turtle101 » 05-12-2011 12:47 PM

I'm going to continue to post here just like before. I come and go becuase of our traveling. I too. left for awhile, not totally just didn't feel good here for a long time. I told Linnea ....When "I"start feeling better I would post once in a while and when I'm home I'll post alittle more .

I myself dont believe that wether you posted 40 times to 10,000 time makes you a good pirate or bad one. If your forthy times maybe your that person who didn't have anything to say.....you just trolled.....and read. thats so cool....god knows some of this stuff needs to be read, theres alot to read here. Lot of pirates have lots on their minds and rewrite Loooong essay, too cool, so instead of sitting down with a glass of wine and reading a good book you sit down read a good post. comments are optional as always.

This is the only Fantistic Forum in my eyes. I have signed up for others. Even FF2 But I will always come back here. Maybe even just stay here, ok, ok I'll just stay here....well maybe....then again why not, started here....geezzzzzzzz....rats. I'm getting dizzy again.

Fantistic Forum is enbedded on my Fav Link Bar all other forums I need to google before I go there.

I have been listening to Art Bell forever and will cont.....thats what brought me here to the Fantistic Forum in the first place.

YOU GO FAN IT"SYOU SHIP......YOU SAIL HER.... arrr arrr

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Post by Fan » 05-12-2011 12:53 PM

It is OUR ship. I am just looking after it.

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turtle101
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Post by turtle101 » 05-12-2011 01:01 PM

but your the Captian of OUR ship....now...AAAARRRRR!!!
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megman
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Post by megman » 05-12-2011 01:14 PM

Unfortunately you can only please half the people half the time......

Uncertainty and change. These are the 2 things that get people moving.

I remember many years back logging into FF one day only to find the place shuttered. Many members were frustrated and lost and this led to the creation of another board.

The FF recovered and some members returned and some didn't. Sure there was some ill-will at the start but eventually both boards co-existed with no animosity.

I (along with everyone else)logged in last week to be greeted by a page telling me the forum and domain were for sale after assurances that it would be business as usual.

This led to the creation of another board. Sure, I signed up. I've been associated with many of those people for many years. But it doesn't mean I will avoid this place. There is no reason that both boards can't co-exist. I've been through this us/them thing before. It's gotten old.

I've seen a lot of ups and downs here at FF in 11 years. Linnea has built a legacy if you will and it would be a shame to just let it die. I'm sure she would be proud to still see it floating in another 11 years.

Thanks FAN for keeping it alive and just keep doing what you do so well.

Mike
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