Republican committee chair proposes to make the Patriot Act PERMANENT. It has worked so well, after all. Remember that 0 out of 5,000 American Arabs they seized were prosecuted. Sensenbrenner strikes again...
Permanent Patriot Act Proposed
Patriot Act made permanent?
Moderator: Super Moderators
Patriot Act made permanent?
We must, indeed, all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately. B. Franklin
Flat Out Lying
The statements that officials are saying that they never check book stores, and library books is a flat out lie.
Didn't they check Monica Lewinsky's books during the witch hunt of Ken Star.
The book stores in San Francisco such as "The Anarchist's Bookstore and Collective" as well as all of the used book stores are constantly being monitored by the F.B.I.: Used book stores in San Francisco are monitored by the F.B.I.
The San Francisco F.B.I. is far off of any kind of reality about what they are supposed to be doing, their vendetta agendas, and their investigative techniques. They will not investigate what they are supposed to - period.
There must be something going on as far as loyalty to another Government not ours.
They in fact surveilance UFO books in San Francisco; in new book stores, and used book stores and yes The Anarchist Book Store.
Didn't they check Monica Lewinsky's books during the witch hunt of Ken Star.
The book stores in San Francisco such as "The Anarchist's Bookstore and Collective" as well as all of the used book stores are constantly being monitored by the F.B.I.: Used book stores in San Francisco are monitored by the F.B.I.
The San Francisco F.B.I. is far off of any kind of reality about what they are supposed to be doing, their vendetta agendas, and their investigative techniques. They will not investigate what they are supposed to - period.
There must be something going on as far as loyalty to another Government not ours.
They in fact surveilance UFO books in San Francisco; in new book stores, and used book stores and yes The Anarchist Book Store.
Dr. Newel
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Shirleypal
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Re: Flat Out Lying
drnewel wrote: The statements that officials are saying that they never check book stores, and library books is a flat out lie.
Didn't they check Monica Lewinsky's books during the witch hunt of Ken Star.
The book stores in San Francisco such as "The Anarchist's Bookstore and Collective" as well as all of the used book stores are constantly being monitored by the F.B.I.: Used book stores in San Francisco are monitored by the F.B.I.
The San Francisco F.B.I. is far off of any kind of reality about what they are supposed to be doing, their vendetta agendas, and their investigative techniques. They will not investigate what they are supposed to - period.
There must be something going on as far as loyalty to another Government not ours.
They in fact surveilance UFO books in San Francisco; in new book stores, and used book stores and yes The Anarchist Book Store.
Interesting post , tell me what is the point of doing that, if I go into a book store and pay cash for a book, what do they do, follow me home so they know where I live since there is no receipt with my information on it.
They are Crazy
In case you haven't figured it out. The San Francisco F.B.I. is acting like they are under lunatic, and insane management.
Dr. Newel
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Cherry Kelly
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They're not just renewing it, but making it worse. With the version Sensenbrenner has proposed, FBI agents will be able to write their own search warrants, with no bother with the court. They will also get expanded powers to subpoena records without the approval of a judge or grand jury. All they have to do is say it's a "terrorist" investigation, or that it's for "national security," and we've already seen they can paint that one with a broad brush. Kiss the Fourth Amendment goodbye.
The Senate Select Committee on Intelligence just reported out S. 1266, introduced by Pat Roberts (R-Kan), which would give the FBI the power to issue "administrative subpoenas" to demand any document they want without going to a judge first. The FBI could use them in any intelligence investigation "to protect against" international terrorism or spying. These subpoenas would not require prior judicial approval, and could only be challenged by recipients - such as hospitals or credit card companies - which may or may not have an incentive to do so. The subpoenas would contain an automatic and permanent secrecy order preventing a recipient from disclosing the demand publicly. These subpoenas could easily be used to investigate lawful activity. Under the language of the bill, they are not restricted to investigations of terrorism but rather investigations to "protect against terrorism" or other national security threats.
All this stuff is an attempt to deprive judges of the ability to check the executive branch's search and seizure power. James Madison's idea of checks and balances doesn't hold much weight with this crowd. Without a middle class and with a growing upper middle who want to keep it all, it will be easier to maintain dictatorship status quo.
Today (7/13) We the People made a tiny bit of headway, as explained by AP:
It's hard to find the quintessential example that makes everyone realize that privacy is important, but I just about an innocent mother of two being told by a local librarian she'd been fingered because she took out too many true crime books. Yet Bushco claims the feds have never requested records. Riiiight.
Roving wire taps is it allow the state to wiretap massive numbers of people with one warrant. Bill calls his sister then leaves. The FBI puts a tap on his sister. He uses her phone the next week to call his buddy Sam. The state then taps his sisters phone and Sam's phone. And on.. and on.. and on. Its a legalistic trick to get around the bill of rights and in effect target groups of people. Groups like.. Democrats, campaign workers, peace groups, minority groups, etc. Don't forget the "no fly" lists, where you could end up mistakenly or intentionally.
Our Republican-led government is telling us that there shouldn't be any right to privacy, confidentiality, anonymity, free movement, and certainly not to any absolute personal freedom. Stubborness and blind soldiering have no place when liberty and freedom are at stake. If people don't care much about privacy concerns, when these are presented at the forefront of liberty concerns, people to an extent do not care.
If this doesn't set right with you, here's a group that will help you transslate your thoughts into action (you can find your state in the window in the upper right hand corner):
http://www.bordc.org/
Here's some specific discussion on how you can get active locally:
http://www.bordc.org/involved/tools.php
The Senate Select Committee on Intelligence just reported out S. 1266, introduced by Pat Roberts (R-Kan), which would give the FBI the power to issue "administrative subpoenas" to demand any document they want without going to a judge first. The FBI could use them in any intelligence investigation "to protect against" international terrorism or spying. These subpoenas would not require prior judicial approval, and could only be challenged by recipients - such as hospitals or credit card companies - which may or may not have an incentive to do so. The subpoenas would contain an automatic and permanent secrecy order preventing a recipient from disclosing the demand publicly. These subpoenas could easily be used to investigate lawful activity. Under the language of the bill, they are not restricted to investigations of terrorism but rather investigations to "protect against terrorism" or other national security threats.
All this stuff is an attempt to deprive judges of the ability to check the executive branch's search and seizure power. James Madison's idea of checks and balances doesn't hold much weight with this crowd. Without a middle class and with a growing upper middle who want to keep it all, it will be easier to maintain dictatorship status quo.
Today (7/13) We the People made a tiny bit of headway, as explained by AP:
Big deal! "Modest proposals?" One in TWO THOUSAND AND TEN provisions expiring? Aren't we lucky?The Republican-led House Intelligence Committee approved Democratic provisions Wednesday that would place modest controls over the ways the FBI can monitor terror suspects under the Patriot Act.
Committee chairman Peter Hoekstra, R-Mich., opened the session to the public in a limited way by allowing one news organization The Associated Press to attend, in a move that aides said was unprecedented.
Three other amendments that Democrats proposed failed, including one that would have blocked investigators from getting records from libraries or book stores.
The panel approved a measure that would let one provision expire in 2010, unless extended by Congress, that allows the FBI to wiretap "lone wolf" terrorists who may be operating on their own, without control from a foreign agent or power.
Lawmakers also accepted another Democratic proposal requiring federal agents to give more detail to judges about roving wire taps, which don't require investigators to specify the name of the targeted person or the mode of communication.
It's hard to find the quintessential example that makes everyone realize that privacy is important, but I just about an innocent mother of two being told by a local librarian she'd been fingered because she took out too many true crime books. Yet Bushco claims the feds have never requested records. Riiiight.
Roving wire taps is it allow the state to wiretap massive numbers of people with one warrant. Bill calls his sister then leaves. The FBI puts a tap on his sister. He uses her phone the next week to call his buddy Sam. The state then taps his sisters phone and Sam's phone. And on.. and on.. and on. Its a legalistic trick to get around the bill of rights and in effect target groups of people. Groups like.. Democrats, campaign workers, peace groups, minority groups, etc. Don't forget the "no fly" lists, where you could end up mistakenly or intentionally.
Our Republican-led government is telling us that there shouldn't be any right to privacy, confidentiality, anonymity, free movement, and certainly not to any absolute personal freedom. Stubborness and blind soldiering have no place when liberty and freedom are at stake. If people don't care much about privacy concerns, when these are presented at the forefront of liberty concerns, people to an extent do not care.
If this doesn't set right with you, here's a group that will help you transslate your thoughts into action (you can find your state in the window in the upper right hand corner):
http://www.bordc.org/
Here's some specific discussion on how you can get active locally:
http://www.bordc.org/involved/tools.php
We must, indeed, all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately. B. Franklin
Re: Re: Flat Out Lying
Shirleypal wrote: Interesting post , tell me what is the point of doing that, if I go into a book store and pay cash for a book, what do they do, follow me home so they know where I live since there is no receipt with my information on it.
Shirleypal, well I dunno fer sure, however, if you are driving your car, they got ya! It's quite a stretch to pay one agent to follow one person from a bookstore to their home, seems to me, too. Do they photograph, and later attempt to identify out of millions? I dunno?
Ninerism
Re: Flat Out Lying
drnewel wrote: The statements that officials are saying that they never check book stores, and library books is a flat out lie.
Didn't they check Monica Lewinsky's books during the witch hunt of Ken Star.
The book stores in San Francisco such as "The Anarchist's Bookstore and Collective" as well as all of the used book stores are constantly being monitored by the F.B.I.: Used book stores in San Francisco are monitored by the F.B.I.
The San Francisco F.B.I. is far off of any kind of reality about what they are supposed to be doing, their vendetta agendas, and their investigative techniques. They will not investigate what they are supposed to - period.
There must be something going on as far as loyalty to another Government not ours.
They in fact surveilance UFO books in San Francisco; in new book stores, and used book stores and yes The Anarchist Book Store.
Dr.Newel, why UFO books?!
Anyway, I have heard that the FBI has sought to ELIMINATE via purchase of ALL the used books in used books stores that expose certain intelligence links, such as: 'THE ULTIMATE EVIL' by author Maury Terry!
Why? Because some sleuths were beginning to establish how intell-agencies were using certain groups to foster 'satanism' in order to mask the Narco-politiks of the New Order and its agendas to see to it that illicit narcotics are distributed into many cities.
'THE ULTIMATE EVIL' exposes the fact that 'lone killer' David Berkowitz was involved with a group who were dealing narcotics not just in New York, but likely in other States across the country.
Those random hits in New York, supposedly committed only by Son of Sam David Berkowitz, may not have been so random, either, at least not all of those killings. They successfully portrayed Berkowitz as a looney because he allegedly spoke to his neighbor's barking dog, and thus became notorious and crazed killer known as Son of Sam, or SS, as it were! Yeah, the clues, as they say, are right there up front sometimes in a very strange lingo.
Maury Terry's book received virtually no reviews, unfortunately. It remains an important work, since it exposes how certain cops were on the payroll, too, of nefarious forces that get narcotics distributed in many venues, including clubs, bars, etc etc etc, kinda old stuff, goes back to days of Prohibition.
Moreover, apparently Berkowitz was privvy to certain details of a notorious 'satanic' slaying that occurred at a church at Stanford U., in California. The police were stymied in that bit, since they claimed that Berkowitz was acting solely on his own as a lone crazed killer. Well, that's not the case. Berkowitz could not have known about the 'satanic' hit committed inside the church unless he had friends or associates of associates who provided him details.
'Satanism' was also a cover for the notorious slayings involving Dr. McDonald, too......drug users and dealers working on or at the military base where his family was slain. Drugs were being shipped inside body bags of American soldiers killed in Vietnam.
Interestingly, Maury Terry's friend was mentioned in that book. He was also mentioned in the book, 'BLACK HELICOPTERS OVER AMERICA' authored by JIM KEITH, who opens his book with discussions/reviews of high-strangeness of CATTLE MUTILATIONS.
ED SANDERS apparently wrote quite an article published in September 1976, in 'OUI' 'zine about CATTLE MUTLIATIONS, SATANISM, UFO's, and BIO-WARFARE allegations......things about clostridia, and canisters of clostridia missing from a military base! Clostriida is oftentimes used to manufacture various bio-warfare agents.
Oddly, ED SANDERS was apparently terrorized after he his article was published in 'OUI' magazine! "Satanism" was partly a cover story being used by government op's at that time, to dissuade Americans from even thinking that some or many CATTLE MUTILATIONS might involve bio-warfare agendas.
Then came brain-rot disease, KJD in humans, prions infecting CATTLE and SHEEP by the tens of thousands in England, and now coming here, too, but only in one or two they say. The strange prion disease has spread to many feral animal herds, many mammalian species across the United States, not safe to eat fresh kill of deer, antelope, etc!
No-one knows why the government sought to keep out of the many newspaper articles which have been published in many cities in the United States regarding CATTLE MUTILATIONS, and fact that many veterinarians have diagnosed clostridia infections in many of the cattle, whereby local predators completely avoid te fleshy remains of cattle which have been completely exsanguinated and completely drained of blood. Why would so many cattle mutilations initially be infected, with appearance of being injected, with clostridia? Were other hidden agendas afoot, which have nothing to do with UFO's? Is it more a terrestrial plot?
Per books by Dr.s Allan Cantwell Jr. MD, Dr. Leonard Horowitz, and others, and per the very strange book, 'MARY, FERRIE AND THE MONKEY VIRUS', there are the footprints and dark paths hidden in forrests of information available to the general public, which are leading many researchers to suspect that "AIDS" is part of general developement's and schemes to devise and test various biologicals which are Malthusian in objective to eliminate millions of human beings as useless eaters from planet Earth, with or without the aid of our so-callled 'alien brothers'.
These are dark things inter-related with that same time-period in NEW YORK, 1978 and 1979, as the "AIDS" protocols were underway within the scope of hidden agendas to 'introduce' something into the 'blood trials' to ostensibly develop a vaccine for hepatitis-b, which began the initial "footprints" for "AIDS" developing in certain select communities which helped develop a vaccine, so they thought, for a noble cause.
An unprecdented pandemic was unfolding in NEW YORK and NEW JERSEY, and yet the powers-that-be kept those blood trials going across the United States! Meanwhile, many of those participant's were developing deadly forms of cryptosporidiosis causing relentless diahrrea, brought to them through the city's contaminated drinking water which was not properly testing for and filtering the increasingly deadly cryptosporidium microbe, which was never publicly addressed AT THAT TIME, and not addressed for several years! But, they call it "AIDS FOR A NEW WORLD ORDER", some say.
No major newspapers in the United States are addressing the high-strangeness of the many peculiar deaths of BIOLOGISTS, here and abroad. All of that is left for the supposed loonies who stay-up late to listen to GEORGE NORRY, or read the reviews at http://www.rense.com.
Ninerism
Gotrox wrote: I know for a fact that there is a monthly list of books sent to library directors---and they report back those who have checked them out.
I've seen the form.
So I wonder if Amazon or Borders online give the FBI a list of all who have ordered certain books? Boy this is sounding more and more like a dictatorship....................
House votes to extend Patriot Act
WASHINGTON - The House voted Thursday to extend the USA Patriot Act, the nation's main anti-terrorism tool, just hours after televisions in the Capitol beamed images of a new attack in London.
As similar legislation worked its way through the Senate, House Republicans generally cast the law as a valuable asset in the war on terror. Most Democrats echoed that support but said they were concerned the law could allow citizens' civil liberties to be infringed.
After more than nine hours of debate, the House approved the measure 257-171. Forty-three Democrats joined 214 Republicans in voting to renew key provisions of the Patriot Act that were set to expire at the end of the year.
The bulk of the back-and-forth centered on language making permanent 14 of 16 provisions that had four-year sunset provisions under the original law, which Congress passed overwhelmingly after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.
The bill also includes 10-year extensions to the two other provisions set to expire on Dec. 31, one allowing roving wiretaps and another allowing searches of library and medical records.
"While the Patriot Act and other anti-terrorism initiatives have helped avert additional
Full story
Its all in the timing again:( I wish they could work on this issues surrounding medical coverage in this Country this fast
As similar legislation worked its way through the Senate, House Republicans generally cast the law as a valuable asset in the war on terror. Most Democrats echoed that support but said they were concerned the law could allow citizens' civil liberties to be infringed.
After more than nine hours of debate, the House approved the measure 257-171. Forty-three Democrats joined 214 Republicans in voting to renew key provisions of the Patriot Act that were set to expire at the end of the year.
The bulk of the back-and-forth centered on language making permanent 14 of 16 provisions that had four-year sunset provisions under the original law, which Congress passed overwhelmingly after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.
The bill also includes 10-year extensions to the two other provisions set to expire on Dec. 31, one allowing roving wiretaps and another allowing searches of library and medical records.
"While the Patriot Act and other anti-terrorism initiatives have helped avert additional
Full story
Its all in the timing again:( I wish they could work on this issues surrounding medical coverage in this Country this fast
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spaceprophet
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The scary thing is anyone can be labeled a terrorist. Anyone can be labeled a threat to national security. Anyone can be labeled an enemy combatant.
It's all relative.
They're already using it to fight the War on Drugs, pornography and strip club owners.
I read somewhere that the Pat Act also helps the Feds keep a database of government critical letters-to-the-editor from newspapers across the country.
Don't you just love fascism?
The War on Terra was the best thing that ever happened for the NeoCon crusade.
You can bet they're monitoring us right now. Smile for the camera.
It's all relative.
They're already using it to fight the War on Drugs, pornography and strip club owners.
I read somewhere that the Pat Act also helps the Feds keep a database of government critical letters-to-the-editor from newspapers across the country.
Don't you just love fascism?
The War on Terra was the best thing that ever happened for the NeoCon crusade.
You can bet they're monitoring us right now. Smile for the camera.
It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man. - Jack Handey
spaceprophet wrote: The scary thing is anyone can be labeled a terrorist. Anyone can be labeled a threat to national security. Anyone can be labeled an enemy combatant.
It's all relative.
They're already using it to fight the War on Drugs, pornography and strip club owners.
I read somewhere that the Pat Act also helps the Feds keep a database of government critical letters-to-the-editor from newspapers across the country.
Don't you just love fascism?
The War on Terra was the best thing that ever happened for the NeoCon crusade.
You can bet they're monitoring us right now. Smile for the camera.
very well said ... most of the pat act is directed at the average
citizen and not on those illegal immigrants or terrorist
"Speak softly and carry a big stick" Teddy Roosevelt
Environmentalist and Peace Activist
Bring back my books you stole from me.
Of course, they renewed the Patriot Act! Of course, they did! You don't need Lady Macbeth to tell you that "what's done is done and cannot be undone!" Did the Emperor Diocletian repeal feudalism after he had imposed it on the Roman Empire? You bet your bippy that he didn't --- and his successors made hay out of it while the sun still shone on the Imperium Romanum! Same with the Patriot Act in our time and in our Imperium Amerikanum...
I just hope that, THIS TIME, our congresspeople actually READ the act before they passed it. Those jokes about October of 2001 really got quite irritating, at times... But then, I wouldn't count on it, even now... If they read the act, then they can't pretend that they are ignorant of its contents. And we all know just how important an element of governance "plausible deniability" turns out to be....
I just hope that, THIS TIME, our congresspeople actually READ the act before they passed it. Those jokes about October of 2001 really got quite irritating, at times... But then, I wouldn't count on it, even now... If they read the act, then they can't pretend that they are ignorant of its contents. And we all know just how important an element of governance "plausible deniability" turns out to be....
Last edited by joequinn on 07-22-2005 12:23 PM, edited 1 time in total.
"Fuggedah about it, Jake --- it's Chinatown!"