LA City Council Votes for Civil War 2

[SETIsLady]

One more thought, aren't those that have an issue with "illegal" immigration the same people that are screaming for the Feds to get involved....but YET they are the same people crying there is too much Government. What is a person to think ?

[Kaztronic]

I think that most would agree that their is a difference between big government, and law enforcement.

It's an argument similarly unreasonable to those made when Tea-Party members protest about government spending, and others delightfully point out that taxes pay for the protection and clean-up of those protests.

In my opinion, such arguments don't really address the issues that are of concern to both sides on this matter (and this thing happens on both sides of the political spectrum) - in fact, they might even distract from the greater conversation this country needs to have on these issues that presently divide us.

[HB3]

It's true that the most hardcore libertarians think of nations and borders as the stuff of unsophisticated rubes. At that point, though, libertarianism starts to become indistinguishable from anarchism. Most libertarians recognize the need for some type of federal infrastructure; self-defense is usually at the top of the list.

[HB3]

Oh, so this is what's been going on....

Candidates, Kos go after Rasmussen

It was a week of mixed news for Republicans, especially in the polls conducted by Rasmussen Reports. The independent polling group -- which uses auto-dialing surveys instead of live surveys and is thus able to crank out lots of data -- had the first poll showing Rep. Joe Sestak (D) leapfrogging Pat Toomey (R) in Pennsylvania's U.S. Senate race, and a poll showing Connecticut Attorney General Richard Blumenthal (D) mostly weathering the storm over his Vietnam service scandal.

But it also released surveys showing Republican Senate candidate Rand Paul romping in Kentucky, just as the media was going after Paul for questioning portions of the Civil Rights Act, and a poll showing conservative favorite Nikki Haley (R) surging in South Carolina's gubernatorial race. As a result, Rasmussen has been taking it from both liberal blogger Markos Moulitsas and South Carolina gubernatorial candidate Henry McMaster (R).

"Rasmussen Reports uses randomly-selected, computer-generated calls, often referred to as robo-calls," said McMaster pollster Richard Quinn in a campaign memo. "We've seen in past elections that Rasmussen poll numbers are less reliable than ones conducted using the traditional method of live callers speaking one-on-one to registered voters with a history Republican primary participation."

At his blog, Moulitsas authored a post titled "Rasmussen's (dishonest) game," accusing the pollster of caring "only about setting the narrative that Democrats are doomed" by eschewing polls on this week's races for polls on races that showed Republicans romping, notably by missing out on the Democratic victory in PA-12.

Scott Rasmussen, the firm's president, laughed off the criticism. "I assume you recall that we were first to show Sestak catching Specter and our final showed Sestak by 5," he said. "On PA-12, we never poll House districts. We focus on statewide polls. We cover every senate and gov race in the country. The more competitive ones get more coverage." And when I've spoken to Rasmussen in the past, he's said that the firm decides what issues and races to cover the way a newspaper decides what to cover -- what's going to be newsy, what will set the narrative.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/right- ... asmus.html

"Nice independent polling website you've got here. Shame if something should happen to it."

[Psychicwolf]

Dora the Explorer: illegal immigrant?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37279132/ns/us_news-life/

[HB3]

Meanwhile....

Rhode Island Lawmaker Files Bill That Follows Arizona Immigration Law

May 20, 2010

State Rep. Peter G. Palumbo, saying that he’s “fed up,” and “we’re all under attack” by illegal immigrants, has filed a bill mirroring a controversial Arizona law that is considered the toughest immigration legislation in the country.

Palumbo’s bill, like the Arizona law, gives local police more authority to question and arrest illegal immigrants. It makes failure to carry immigration documents a state crime, and requires police to question people “where reasonable suspicion exists” that the person is unlawfully in the United States. The bill, H 8142, also targets people who hire illegal immigrants, or who knowingly transport them.

Much of Palumbo’s bill is taken verbatim from the Arizona bill, SB 1070, signed into law by Gov. Jan Brewer last month, over the objection of President Obama.

Palumbo, a Cranston Democrat, had stated he had no plans to file such legislation this year. But he changed his mind last week as opposition to the Arizona law—including a spreading economic boycott and legal challenges—continued to mount.

“What pushed me over the edge was, when I heard the mayor of San Francisco and mayor of L.A. chastising the governor [Brewer] for her efforts, I just snapped. When they said they’re going to economically boycott one of their sovereign states—that’s what did it,” Palumbo said.

http://www.projo.com/news/content/RI_AR ... 59e50.html

[HB3]

Here's your latest Austrian-Libertarian propaganda for the day:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6qEQ-Kn ... r_embedded

Hey, I bet this Nazi frog is the one who beat up Dora. Rationality is so...nativist.

[OMG]

I do believe the difference is to be found in that they want to become Americans. They adapt to the American way of life

No fair. Cubans already play baseball, soccer the big thing in Mexico. It's much easier for Cubans to fit in.

But on a bit more of a serious note, don't you think Cubans maybe are able to fit in more because they are on the most part welcomed with understanding and open arms, while Mexicans are viewed and treated with disdain because they want to "Take our jobs"

[HB3]

Oh, so this is who beat up Dora....

Activists Blast Mexico’s Immigration Law

USA Today
May 25, 2010

Arizona’s new law forcing local police to take a greater role in enforcing immigration law has caused a lot of criticism from Mexico, the largest single source of illegal immigrants in the United States.

But in Mexico, illegal immigrants receive terrible treatment from corrupt Mexican authorities, say people involved in the system.

And Mexico has a law that is no different from Arizona’s that empowers local police to check the immigration documents of people suspected of not being in the country legally.

“There (in the United States), they’ll deport you,” Hector Vázquez, an illegal immigrant from Honduras, said as he rested in a makeshift camp with other migrants under a highway bridge in Tultitlán. “In Mexico they’ll probably let you go, but they’ll beat you up and steal everything you’ve got first.”

Mexico’s Foreign Ministry said the law [Arizona’s SB1070] “violates inalienable human rights” and Democrats in Congress applauded Mexican President Felipe Calderón’s criticisms of the law in a speech he gave on Capitol Hill last week.

Yet Mexico’s Arizona-style law requires local police to check IDs. And Mexican police freely engage in racial profiling and routinely harass Central American migrants, say immigration activists.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2010 ... ants_N.htm

[Cherry Kelly]

OMG - on a serious note. As stated it is not JUST Mexicans coming here illegally. It is not just jobs, but the demand for all the freebies, demands on our cities, counties, states and even federal level too. They demand we teach schools in their language. They demand we give them all the freebies (from food to medical to housing) and have signs, literature, etc. in their language. They demand that their flags be flown...and refuse to follow laws. They refuse to assimilate. Take a look at the federal prisons and see how many illegals are now in the populace. We aren't talking for being illegal, but for crimes, major criminal action.

Here in the KC metro (KS side) just in last few years, a massage parlor was shut down (three - maybe four owned by same group). Why - illegal Chinese employees. Take a look at some news headlines - warning to TX about other than Mexican illegals.

Jobs yes, there are companies that hire illegals, often without knowing they are illegal due to the papers presented that claim these people are here on legal work visas. There are companies that hire and don't care.

[HB3]

Here's a thought. Just how likely is it that all the Democrats criticizing the bill are telling the truth when they say they haven't read it? Of course it's possible, but here's another interpretation: they have read it, but, upon reading it, couldn't find any unconstitutional language. If there were, wouldn't they be screaming the offending lines at the top of their lungs, wouldn't the Nazi-like language contained in the bill be all over the press, screen-crawling on CNN/MSNBC, etc? Note that critics have gone from saying the bill mandates discrimination to saying that it "could cause" discrimination.

There does seem to be some reported ambiguity within the Justice Department. Again, it'll be interesting to see if they do mount a civil case against it. If it isn't an open and shut case, though, why would they risk the embarrassment of losing? There's plenty of other challenges to the law already.

[HB3]

L.A. County supervisor calls Arizona boycott 'stupid' and irresponsible.

May 27, 2010

Characterizing it as "stupid," L.A. County Supervisor Mike Antonovich has criticized a proposal by two colleagues to have the county government boycott Arizona over the state's crackdown on illegal immigration.

"This knee-jerk reaction to support lawbreakers at the expense of law-abiding legal immigrants and other residents is irresponsible," Antonovich said in a statement.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2 ... agree.html

[HB3]

Hey, are all these people somehow advocating Civil War by opposing the LA City Council boycott?

About that boycott of Arizona over its new illegal immigrant law? 82% of Americans say, Nah!

May 27, 2010 | 5:44 am

Despite President Obama's claim that he sees no congressional appetite to address immigration reform this midterm election year, there's more convincing evidence this week that Americans want it.

No White House administration wants to admit that it governs by polls. And this one hasn't. For more than a year now polls have shown the top concerns on American minds are....

...jobs and the economy. As a result, this Obama White House and the whopping Democratic congressional majorities lead by Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi invested those many months in rancorous intra-party debate to obtain broad healthcare legislation.Arizona state Flag

But pollsters keep asking the other questions:

Out Wednesday is a new CNN/Public Opinion poll indicating that even more Americans want:

-- The number of illegal immigrants decreased (76%, up from 73%).

-- Illegal immigrants removed from the country (41%, up from 37%).

-- To halt the influx of illegal immigrants and deport those here (60%).

-- To assign more federal agents to security on the Mexico border (88%).

-- To fine employers of illegal immigrants tens of thousands of dollars (71%).

As you may know, frustrated with federal inaction on border security, Arizona recently passed its own tough new law on illegal immigrants. Asked, "Do you favor or oppose this law?" 57% were in favor of it and 37% were opposed.

Now, how about boycotting Arizona over this new law? Nope -- 82%.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washing ... rewer.html

[OMG]

They demand we teach schools in their language. They demand we give them all the freebies (from food to medical to housing) and have signs, literature, etc. in their language. They demand that their flags be flown...and refuse to follow laws. They refuse to assimilate.

What does this "demand" mean, who are they demanding? I don't think govt should push "spanish only"or "spanish mandatory rules". But if a govt thinks there is enough people who more comfortable in spanish and think it's smart to put stuff out in both languages, I don't see a problem with that. As for business, again people can demand anything they want but businesses don't have to do it and Spanish people can purchase or not purchase at that store.

For people who talk about free and open society, the word assimilation sure is said a lot. If we are in a free society, then if somebody wants to speak Spanish and watch Telemundo on their off time then that's their right. If we have a free market, is somebody wants to hire Spanish first speakers, it's their right in my mind and you as a customer can go or not go. I know I've ordered food when I had a difficult time understanding the guy on the other line, and if it's really bad I don't ask the govt to fire him or punish the store, I just order from another place. I think SETis brings a point, the guys who say keep govt out of our lives, are the same people who want to push "English only" rules.

As for the first part, I don't really know what this is, is there now widespread whites being forced all of a sudden to learn everything in Spanish? Or are we talking about Spannish people learning stuff in Spanish (and learning English on the side) which wouldn't that be smarter to teach stuff like Math or Science in a language they understand, instead of forcing it in English and it goes over their head because they can't understand the language? Also not a horrible thing for English people to learn some Spanish, especially if you are in a border location. You can put as big a fence as you want, but there always will be crossover, spanish is actually spoken around the world slightly more than english.

English is spoken more now around Europe, I'm guess some of the previous generations were screaming much like Repub/Conserv in this nation "Keep our native language strong" but if they wanted to do business across the pond, or the biggest market in Europe. English seems to be the default language so their newer generatoins understood they have to adapt. That's our problem, we have fallen behind, we are still putting up giant walls and "english only"rules, and calling for assimilation instead of adapting to the changing landscape. Maybe that's the big fear here, if we start becoming more of a bilingual nation then the Mexican who speaks his native tounge but also took the time here to speak English starts having a much more impressive resume than the person who lived through life with thoughts of "Damn Mexicans and there language, speak English!". I never viewed language as an identity to a nation, it's the people who make the nation. Then again as a nation accepting and learning spanish is great practice for when we all need to speak Mandarin in a couple of decades

[HB3]

Actually, what happens in practice is we end up with people illiterate in multiple languages rather than quasi-illiterate in just one. Great improvement...

And you can talk to your average friendly Canadian about the "benefits" of a bi-lingual society.